If you are citizen of an European Union member nation, you may not use this service unless you are at least 16 years old.
You already know Dokkio is an AI-powered assistant to organize & manage your digital files & messages. Very soon, Dokkio will support Outlook as well as One Drive. Check it out today!

Patay

Page history last edited by Rob Brennan 12 years, 10 months ago

Patay

The following is a scenario and game report for the battle of Patay fought on June 18, 1429. The scenario was designed as a DBMM 200 game but could be adapted to any system. It presents an excellent non-tournament style running battle and has the added feature of Brilliant commanders on both sides. In DBMM (and DBM, DBA) the Order of Battle is:

The English

Talbot

1 Reg Kn(O) CIC Brilliant

12 + 10 + 12 = 34

1 Reg Kn(I) 10 = 10

4 Bw(S)m 8 X 4 = 40

84 ME (w/Bag): 11; 3/4/6

Falstaff

1 Reg Kn(O) Ally 12 + 5 = 17

1 Reg Kn(I) 10 = 10

5 Reg Bl(I)m (False French) 7 X 5 = 35

62 ME (w/Bag): 12; 4/5/7

White Banner (the name of the commander of the English Van is not given in the sources but is named for his distinctive white banner)

1 Reg Kn(O) Ally 12 + 5 = 17

1 Reg Kn(I) 10 = 10

4 Reg Bl(O)m 8 X 4 = 24

3 Ireg Bag(I) 3 X 3 = 03

54 ME (w/Bag): 14; 4/5/8

Army Total: 200

The English army is generally estimated to be between 3500 and 5000 men though the latter figure probably includes the rather large train attached (including guns). Falstaff is reported to have joined the army with 1000 Men at Arms (no mention of archers) which were mostly drawn from the Paris militia. Only one battle was composed of pure English and the rest were probably mostly false French, indeed for a large stretch of the campaign the Frenchman Charles de la Ramee had commanded the van guard. Falstaff and White Banner are rated as allies to simulate the massive command control failure of the English in which each battle deployed as per its own ideas and refused to cooperate. It also helps explain Talbot´s belief that he was betrayed by Falstaff. Just prior to the battle 500 English archers were hastily attached to Talbot (who may have had about 200 of his own). This concentrated almost all the available

archers under Talbot. It is assumed this was accomplished by having Talbot take command of the Rear Guard the only pure English battle. Falstaff may have been the actual CIC.

The French

La Hire

1 Ireg Kn(S) Sub 12 + 5 = 17

2 Ireg Kn(S) 12 X 2 = 24

5 Ireg Kn(O) 10 X 5 = 50

91 ME: 18; 5/7/10

Joan of Arc

1 Ireg Kn(S) CIC Brilliant 12 + 5 + 12 = 29

2 Ireg Bw(O) 4 X 2 = 08

1 Ireg Aux(I) 1 X 2 = 02

4 Reg Bl(O) 4 X 7 = 28

2 Ireg Horde(S) volunteers 2 X 2 = 04

71 ME: 11.5; 3/4/6

Richemont

1 Ireg Kn(S) Ally 12 + 2 = 14

4 Ireg Sp(O) 4 X 4 = 16

2 Ireg Bw(O) 4 X 2 = 08

38 ME: 10; 3/4/6

Army Total: 200

The French army had reached about 6000 by the time of the battle as some 1000 additional volunteers had joined the column as it advanced from Orleans. The volunteers are depicted as Horde(S) followers of the Maid. Richemont, the disgraced constable of France, is depicted as an ally since Joan did not trust him and was persuaded to accept his 1000 men at arms and archers only because her commanders feared Richemont would otherwise go over to the English. His troops are depicted as mercenary types to make this fear more plausible.

The Field

The game is played long ways on a 6X4 table (or 5X3 in 15mm). The "top" of the table is North. Two roads, the Old Roman Road running from the South West corner to the North East corner and the Patay Road running from the South East corner to the North West corner, should intersect forming an "X" at approximately the middle of the table. The village of Lignarolles and, behind the village, a wood should fill most of the North West corner. The village and wood start about 400-500 paces up the Patay Road. On the opposite side of the Patay Road just south of the village stands a low ridge which ends about 240 paces north of the cross roads. A hedge should run along the Old Roman Road about 240 paces on each side of the cross roads on the north side of the Roman Road. Finally a second village, Roumilly appears on the southern end of the Patay road occupying most of the South East coroner. You may add a

Rough going field to the north of the Patay road near the village of Lignarolles. The Wood can be a 2 FE feature the rest are 1 FE.

Initial Deployment

Both the exact location of the battle and initial set up is problematic. One issue that has frustrated historians is the road actually taken by the English. It´s clear from the sources that the English were marching to Janville located North East on the Old Roman Road. Waurin, who was with the English, states, however, that the army was headed toward Patay when the French struck. This would have required the column to turn North West on to the Patay road. I have resolved this by assuming that the army, aware of the approaching French, turned off the Roman road onto the Patay road in order to reach the more defensible terrain located in that direction.

The battle begins with most of the English army having reached the cross roads and made the turn up the Patay road but with Talbot just reaching the cross roads and its hedges. Place the head of Talbot´s battle just short of the cross roads in column facing NORTH along the Old Roman Road. Place Falstaff´s battle has just beyond the turn in column facing North West along the Patay road. Place White Flag´s battle in front of Falstaff also in column facing North West and about to reach Leganolies. . All three battles have their backs turned to the French.

The French, having been altered to the near by English by a treacherous stag, have sent their mounted forces forward to catch the English before then can deploy. Consequently La Hire can set up in any formation 240 paces south of the rear of the English column (i.e. Talbot). Joan enters on turn one in column on the south edge marching up the Old Roman Road, Richemont enters right behind Joan also in column.

The Replay

This replay was fought using the 1/4/2010 version of the DBMM rules (i.e. when columns could March within 400 paces) and 25mm figures. Normally I do one practice game with an impressed opponent and then two serious solitaire play test games. Given Phil´s desire to put 2.0 to bed, I´m submitting the practice game in the interest of time.

Turn One

They therefore put their army into battle order and prepared to wait for the English attack. Then the lord Duke of Alencon, in the presence of the lord constable and myself, asked Joan what he ought to do. She answered him in a loud voice, saying "You all have good spurs".

The Bastard of Orleans

English took first bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 4 Falstaff 5 Talbot 5

Seeing the danger of the approaching French, White Flag uses his PIPS to move the baggage off road into the field and snap his column into a line facing south along the Patay road. Falstaff does the same but with more PIPS and no baggage to mess with he moves onto the ridge and begins to deploy. Finally Talbot expends a Brilliant stroke to double his PIPS and starts Marching even though he´s within 400 paces of La Hire´s hard charging French. This forces Talbot to do the first March move straight up the Old Roman Road. Instead of making the turn and getting behind the South-North hedge, he is forced to deploy along the Patay road. Using his many PIPS Talbot does manage to turn his troops around and form line on both sides of the cross roads but with all his troops (including mounted archers) still mounted.

French bound.

PIP Rolls: La Hire 6 Joan 6 Richemont 2 (well at least he´s loyal)

La Hire has deployed in two ranks of 4 Knights (mostly S in front rank). He wheels and then Marches this formation parallel with the Old Roman Road with one flank on the hedge. As Talbot´s archers are still mounted, I rule that La Hire can keep Marching toward them but in the end falls just short of contact (but quite close). Joan marches fast up the Roman Road with Richemont lagging behind.

The English then auto dismount in Shooting Phase and shoot but are ineffective.

Turn Two

The vanguard of the French were impatient for attack, having lately found the English very slack in their defense, and made so sudden and violent a charge that they were unable to form themselves in proper order.

De Montstrelet

English Bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 3 Falstaff 3 Talbot 2

Despite low PIPs Talbot decides to hold onto his last "stroke" and with two PIPs has one archer plant stakes while another wheels in along the hedge to provide flanking fire. This leaves Talbot and his fellow Knights still mounted. Falstaff and White Flag deploy their Blades along the ridge but Falstaff must deploy his mounted Knights and one Blade to cover the gap between the ridge and hedge. The flanking English archer manages to recoil on back rank Knight.

French Bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 1 Joan 5 Richemont 3

La Hire has no choice but to charge Talbot, hurling one Knight right into the stakes but La Hire´s element hits Talbot with the rest of the French Knights over lapping the English on the French right. Meanwhile the recoiled French Knight jumps the hedge and heads for the flanking archer. Joan with plenty of PIPs holds her "strokes" for combat and begins to deploy her battle into line facing the ridge. She does send her two Horde(S) up the road to help La Hire in the swirling cat fight up ahead (a better place for Hordes). Richemont trundles down the Roman Road - a final reserve.

La Hire element strikes first slaying Talbot in single combat (3-1) and thanks to the "General kill +1" saves his adjacent Knight from a 1-6 disaster. The French Knight at the stakes is only "Fled".

Turn 3

The French had thrown to the ground the lord de Talbot, had made him prisoner and all his men being dead, and were the French already so far advanced in the battle that they could at will take or kill whomsoever they wanted to.

Jean de Wavrin

PIP rolls: White Flag 2 Falstaff 3 Talbot 1

With one PIP and no commander, Talbot´s battle is paralyzed. Both Falstaff and White Flag peal off the their still mounted Knights and attempt to go to "Talbot´s" aid. Talbot´s lone Kn(I) having beaten his French counter part now finds itself in the middle of the French line and promptly goes under. This should have broken Talbot but I miscounted the ME and only disheartened his command. (Hey it´s the practice game.)

French Bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 2 Joan 2 Richemont 4

La Hire now largely losses control of his Knights who plunge in seeking the nearest English dog. This leads one Knight(O) to hurl itself onto the English stakes and this time perish in the attempt. Other Knights jump the hedge and join the fight against the flanking English archer still hanging on along the hedge. Meanwhile Joan´s Hordes nearly reach La Hire´ Knights at the hedge. The rest of her battle trundles toward Falstaff on the hill and Richemont at last catches up.

Turn 4

English Bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 2 Falstaff 1 Talbot 1

With few PIPs Falstaff plunges his Knights into the hedge battle to help Talbot´s embattled archer. The English position is now roughly an "L" with one line along the ridge but the mounted Men at Arms now at a 90 degree angle along the hedge. Falstaff´s Kn(I) companion manages to slay a French Knight and pursues back to the hedge now held by Joan´s Horde(S). White Flag and his Knights move back down the Patay road to the cross road to cover the gap in hedge created by the Patay Road.

French Bound

PIP rolls: La Hire 3 Joan 3 Richemont 1

Joan uses her PIPS to maneuver Hordes who combined with La Hire´s stray Knights pull down and kill the hated English at the hedge to cries of "the Maid", "the Maid"! Falstaff´s first loss. La Hire regains some control and bends back the line of Talbot´s archers finally over running them, Shattering this command.

Turn 5

English bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 1 Falstaff 3 Talbot XX

Falstaff laying on with his beer mug holds on along the hedge despite Joan´s Hordes and La Hire´s Knights. Meanwhile White Flag´s Knights hold onto the critical gap in hedge to keep La Hire´s Knights from crashing into the English baggage.

French bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 2 Joan 2 Richemont 5

With few PIPs Joan and La Hire cannot break through at the hedge but the Maid´s crossbows begin to ineffectively bombard Falstaff´s Blade(I)s on the ridge. Richemont, however, now snaps his column into a line along the hedge and prepares to add his weight against Falstaff´s legendary bulk.

Turn Six

And then, messier John Falstaff, riding towards the van-guard to join up with them, those of the van-guard thougth that all was lost and that the men of the battle were in flight. Hence, the captain of the van-guard taking it for ture that it was so, with his white standard, he and his men took flight and abandoned the woods.

Jean de Wavrin

English Bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 5 Falstaff 2 Talbot XX

White Flag uses his PIPs to summon some Blade help from the ridge and Falstaff also pulls some Blade(I) false French in to help hold the hedge. Falstaff´s element grimly clings onto "Falstaff´s corner", the pivot point in the English line, while White Flag holds the gap.

French Bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 4 Joan 3 Richemont 5

Joan at last throws her battle onto the ridge position and uses a Brilliant stroke to add to her combat roll. She strikes a Blade just off the ridge and quickly dispatches it (which helps her surrounding crossbow survive the English Blades). The rest of Joan´s Blades just bounce off the Blade(I) along the ridge. Fighting with uncharacteristic fury Falstaff manages to slay one of La Hire´s Knights (this Disheartens La Hire but as he´s all 2ME, he doesn´t care). Across the road though La Hire mounts an all out attack using his Kn(S) on White Flag´s companion Kn(I) and over whelms it. Leaving only White Flag to hold on.

Turn 7

English Bound.

PIP rolls: White Flag 2 Falstaff 2

With few PIPs and heavily engaged both English commanders can do little but call for help from the Blades summoned last turn.

French Bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 1 Joan 2 Richemont 6

Likewise with few PIPS, La Hire and Joan can do little to restrain their impetuous troops who dash forward. Richemont, however, now crosses the hedge in force bringing overwhelming pressure to Falstaff´s corner. So aided Joan´s Horde(S) bring down a Blade(I) [5-1]. The Maid! The Maid! Nothing but pushing and shoving occur along the ridge with Joan´s Blades being pushed back.

Turn 8

Sir John Falstaff and the bastard of Thian, both knights, and their men, who had not dismounted, took flight across the open country to save their lives.

De Monstrelet

PIP rolls: White Flag 6 Falstaff 5

With plenty of PIPS Falstaff launches a counter attack off the ridge and White Flag gets his supporting Blades into position. Unfortunately the arrival of help emboldens White Flag who pushes back his Knight(O) opponent and plunges into the French Knight mass. With somewhat less élan Falstaff´s false French can do nothing despite charging down hill (as it´s their bound). Falstaff, swinging his beer mug at a sea of foes, clings to his corner.

French bound.

PIP rolls: La Hire 5 Joan 2 Richemont 6

With PIPS La Hire can now easily trap the audacious White Flag and finally finishes off the bold English Knight. This loss breaks White Flag´s battle and with it the English army. Only Falstaff remains and he draws off with the remnant of his still unbeaten forces.

Game Notes:

An excellent battle which demonstrates the DBx system´s capability for handling even unusual historical battles.

1. Some though may have to go into mounted archers effect on Marching, I´m not sure my ruling that they could not stop Marching was correct, though it did produce the correct historical result.

2. Stakes would be better handled by just having them grant "Quick Kill" rather than messing with actual models. Like Cavalry charging infantry trying to form square, the Knights shouldn´t quite know it the stakes are successfully deployed.

3. Brilliant stroke rule almost allowed Talbot to "break" the scenario and deploy despite his awkward position. In general the English used the "formation change" rules to deploy much more rapidly than they did historically.

4. Heavy Infantry had little effect and approached busy work as factors were just too high to accomplish much.

Kill Ratios

The following table relates what killed what in terms of points:

French

Kn(S) cost: 50 Kills: 1 Kn(O); 1 Kn(I); 1 Bw(S); 1 Bl(I) 35 (Ratio 50/35)

Kn(O) cost 50 Kills: 1 Kn(O); 1 Bw(S) 20 (Ratio 50/20)

Horde(S) cost 4 Kills: 1 Kn(I); 1 Blade(I) 15 (Ratio 4/15)

Ireg Bw(O) 16 Kills: -- 16/0

Ireg Aux(I) 1 Kills: -- 2/0

Reg Bl(O) 28 Kills: -- 28/0

Ireg Sp(O) 16 Kills:-- 16/0

English