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Magnesia refight

Page history last edited by Rob Brennan 15 years, 9 months ago

We played a refight of Magnesia yesterday with DBMM.

Scale was roughly 1:250 with the Seleucids slightly under-represented, especially in pike. I counted each legion as a command with Eumenes as a fifth but since most of the Roman cavalry was under him, I didn't count him as an ally. I didn't allow the troops in the camp to sally out, though it would have been fair to have given them a dice as a Pip dump - but I forgot!

The Seleucids were in four commands; effectively mounted of the left, infantry of the left, the main pike block plus supports and all the right (under Antiochus).

Roman deployment was as in Livy.

Seleucid deployment was as in Livy but using an idea in a message form way back on, I think Ancmed, where Luke US suggested that Livy was listing units not only side to side but back to front. This gave roughly...

.........Exp.Exp..............

.....................................

Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk Sk

..Cav.Cav.Cav.Cav.....................Cav.Cav.Cav.Cav.

Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.Inf.

(Sk = skirmishers)

The big pike block was in the centre where there aren't cavalry in front.

I gave the right flank the 10000 Argyraspids as this is the commonly suggested size for them. Even though the bit in Livy suggests that the Romans may have been outflanked across the river (despite thinking it was a secure flank), I left all of the Seleucids on the near bank.

The game started with mist causing visibility extra Pip cost. This lasted for about 5 pairs of bounds. (We assumed that battle commenced 1 hour after sunrise so I think the mist would have dispersed after 6 bounds anyway).

The result was pretty historical. The scythed chariots cut up the Pergamene peltasts a bit but were eventually cancelled. I was going to use a rule that Exp doubled by lights are routed instead (so that they would go through the following forces and at least disrupt them) but the Pergamene dice rolls were only enough to just about kill the chariots so it never kicked in.

The Pergamene player (and the Seleucid player opposite) were relatively inexperienced with the rules, and the Pergamenes lost quite a lot of their peltasts by putting themm unnecessarily at risk against Seleucid mounted while not really getting the Roman cavalry into much action. The Seleucid cataphracts on this wing, benefitting from not being disrupted by the destruction of the chariots as in reality, made quite an impact on the Roman legion opposite.

Antiochus's cataphracts were initially nowhere near as successful. This lead to quite a long struggle. The  presence of the Argyraspids was critical - they didn't get into combat but their strength stopped the wing becoming disheartened. Once the Romans became disheartened, the extra -1 in combat caused them to crumble quickly. Unfortuately in this same turn that the Romans were disheartened, Antiochus died after being flanked :( He'd have been more successful as a Kn(X) then (F) wedge as he couldn't manage to double his cavalry opponent and kept pushing him back and following up, resulting in him getting into a vulnerable spot.

Meanwhile, the initially successful Seleucid cavalry on the other wing took enough losses to become broken. The (I) of Kn(X) against blades made a big impact.

Once the Romans and Pergamenes hit the Seleucid infantry on the Roman right, things were fairly qucikly decided. Bd at 4 vs Ax at 3 doesn't seem too bad, but it soon turns into 4 vs 2 in many cases. It doesn't help when you end up with Ax rolling lots of 2s and the Bd rolling lots of 4s! The Seleucid elephant on this wing held up the advance to some extent but couldn't manage to kill one more EE of Pergamenes to break that command.

The command with the big pike block was given a low Pip dice and did very little. The skirmishers held up the Romans a bit, but in the first turn the Galatians had become impetous after the command rolled a one. They killed a couple of Bd, but died to a man. Their main contribution was to hold up the Romans. The Romans commited their African elephant to the fray too, which didn't help the Galatians.

At the close of play, the large pike block was about to be taken in flank by one virtually fresh legion while assaulted head on by the other. The Pergamenes and damaged Latin legion had a pretty free hand to go after the Seleucid camp. The victorious Seleucid right was hamstrung by the loss of Antiochus and was busy pursuing their opponents to the gates of the Roman camp. The high pip cost to do anything meant that bringing the argyraspids across to help the phalanx was going to be difficult. This command was fairly close to being disheartened too.

It was an enjoyable game which was touch and go for both sides for much of the game.

If I played it again I would...

Make the Galatians Irr Bd(I)

Allow the Seleucids to outflank the Romans across the river (and tell the Romans it was secure). I might even make the river the edge of the board and give the Seleucids a small short hook flank march command.

Make any defeat of the scythed chariots by lights cause them to rout to their own table edge (and decide what to do with friendly troops passed through).

Remember to give Antiochus his brilliant status and use his combat dice advantage!

Possibly change the Seleucid command structure on their left.

The whole game took about 5 hours (including time spent looking at the other large game being played at our club at the same time).

 

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