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Later Hoplite Greek Sparta vs Med Portuguese

Page history last edited by PBworks 15 years, 10 months ago

  25mm, 450AP

Well, this started off as an historical match-up - NOT.  However,

the Portuguese medieval army is relatively common, and around one

year in particular, surprisingly.  Even more surprising is that

there are French knights in the list (and yet there are no helots in

the Later Hoplite Greek lists...)

My opponent hadn't used the Portuguese army before, but like me, had

probably faced it.

In changing my testing of the Spartans, I adopted the "Spartiate

Cheering Squad" approach, where there were three commands of 1

Spartan general RegSp(S), 8 IrrSp(O), 8 RegSp(S), 4 RegPs(S) and 2-3

IrrPs(I).  One allied command had Thracian 2 IrrAx(S) and 6 IrrAx

(O), 2 RegPs(S) and 4 Thracian IrrLH(O).  It was designed so that

the loss of all the IrrSp(O) would only dishearted the command (not

that the Spartiates would care) and that the IrrSp(O) would act as

an ablative shield while still killing enough of the enemy for the

RegSp(S) to come in and kill the remainder.  The RegPs(S) were there

to hold difficult terrain or meet Wb head on before the ablative

shield ran into them.

The Portuguese had a large central command of IrrBs(S) and some Kn

(S), a flank command of 8 or so Reg and Irr Kn(S) (French knights?

In Portugal?), 8 mounted English archers, 12 IrrBw(O) amd some LH

(he had MORE LH than me - call them medieval...), and another flank

command of Ps(S), Ps(O) and some more Bw and 2 Ax(O).  All generals

were Kn.  There was a command of Bg(F) roaming around as a gimmick.

The terrain was very kind to the Spartans, two difficult hills

landing on the Spartan side, 720mm apart.  A rocky ground landed in

the Portuguese side out of the way.

The Spartans invaded and had to set up first.  They set up between

the hills, that were luckily (yeah, right) just the right gap for

the 12 element-wide hoplite phalanxs.  The IrrSp(O) were at the

front, the RegSp(S) were in columns to the rear.  The hills were

occupied by the Ax on the left and the Ps(S) and Ps(I) from one

command on the right.  4 Ps(S) were out in front of the IrrSp(O)

phalanx.

The Portuguese set up second and chose to face off the IrrSp(O)

phalanx with a line of Bd(S).  The French Kn and the English longbow

were out on the Portuguese right and the large mob of light infantry

and Bw were out on the left, facing the Spartan right-hand hill with

no Ax on it.

The games started, the Spartans content with moving Sp into the

right flank areas that they couldn't occupy because of the

deployment constraints.  The Portuguese advanced, boldy on their

left to take the Spartan right-hand hill.  This led to a counter by

the Spartans who moved the Ax off their left hand hill and started

to march them across their rear towards their right hand hill, where

there was clearly going to be a fight (and to avoid bow fire from

the Bw(S) and Bw(O) heading their way from the Portugese right-hand

flank command.

As the Portugese came up to (their) left hand hill, they threw

themselves up it, Ps(S) and Ax(O) to the lead, and almost wiped out

the mercenary peltasts trying to hold it (a series of 6-2's

assisted).

As the 12 element wide Sp phalanx was wider than the 9 element Bd(S)

line coming up, to reduce the pressure on the right hand hill, 4

IrrBd(O) lurched out and attacked some Ps on the ground near the

hill, with fairly poor results (it did distract them from supporting

the hill fight though, which was going badly for the Greeks).  The

Greek Ps(S) group in the centre front wheeled and tried to come in

on the flank of the attacking Portuguese light troops but were

caught by the advancing Bs(S) and were spent.  This did break up the

line of Bd(S), and allowed the IrrSp(O) to advance out of their hill

valley and jump some of them.

In the ensuring bounds, the IrrBd(S) took some punishment.  They

dished it out though, killing 10 IrrSp(S).  One Greek command lost

4, and other command lost 5 and another lost 3 (two to Kn charging

in).  However, with support from the RegSp(S) coming up from the

rear, they killed 5 Bd(S).  These losses (at 2 ME each), along with

breaking the Portuguese light forces command broke the Portuguese

army.  The Spartan commands were on 7-7.5ME losses over all three

main Sp commands, and as they became disheartened on 8ME, it was

close, but the casualties were spread across the Sp commands and

none broke.

The French Kn advanced too far and got trapped in front of the right

hand hill that had been evacuated by the Greek Ax(S) and Ax(O) (but

NOT their supporting Ps(S)) and the English Longbow got sidelined in

the same fashion.  The Greek Ax command eventually got over to the

right hand hill and killed a Portuguese Ps(S), which assisted in

breaking that Portuguese command, although the actual telling kill

was by a Greek IrrPs(I) on a Portuguese Ps(S)!

So, for one test result, using a non-historical deployment and army

command composition worked well for tHe Spartans against an

anachronous opponent. However, it looked like the Portuguese chose

the wrong troop match-ups.  They would have been better (I'm not

sure by what amount) to hit the IrrSp(O) with their Kn(S) and not

their Bd(S).

The Spartans should have deployed in columns for all their Spears,

and waited to see who was coming before deploying, although there

was always the fear the IrrSp(O) wouldn't deploy in time due to

their unmanouverability.

Well worth some further investigation, in any event.  And no

Spartiates died.  Plenty of ordinary Greeks did, but who cares?

They were probably democrats.

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